From ’Bone to Bari … and Back!

News, From the Magazine, Michael Dease, Steve Davis

By Allen Morrison I Nov. 5, 2024

“Mike’s an amazing talent on trombone, never mind on tenor and baritone sax,” trombonist Steve Davis says of Dease.
(Photo: Jessica Cowles)

To say that Michael Dease is not resting on his laurels would be an understatement. Long considered one of the jazz world’s most accomplished trombonists, both as a leader and as a sideman, he is deeply engaged in establishing himself as a compelling voice on a wholly different instrument, one that isn’t even in the brass family. Always known for his hard-bop/post-bop lyricism, the 41-year-old Dease has one foot firmly planted in jazz tradition, and one foot in experimentalism.

Dease has two new albums, released within a few weeks of each other. With Grove’s Groove (Le Coq Records), he not only pays tribute to his late colleague and mentor Roy Hargrove but makes a serious pass at admission to the top ranks of baritone saxophonists.

On the second album, Found In Space: The Music Of Gregg Hill (Origin), he continues to explore the quirky, experimental, sometimes humorous musical universe of a 78-year-old jazz aficionado-turned-composer.

A self-taught prodigy on the trombone, Dease entered Juilliard on a full scholarship during its first year offering jazz studies, going on to earn both bachelor’s and master’s degrees. More than a dozen albums and countless side-person appearances followed, including stints with Roy Hargrove, David Sanborn, the Jazz at Lincoln Center Orchestra, the Dizzy Gillespie All-Stars and the big bands of Christian McBride, Nicholas Payton, Charles Tolliver and Rufus Reid. He has also appeared in smaller groups with artists including the Heath Brothers, Renee Rosnes, Winard Harper, Bill Charlap, Claudio Roditi and Lewis Nash.

One of his collaborators on Grove’s Groove is veteran trombonist and perennial DownBeat Critics and Readers Poll favorite Steve Davis. They have been friends and collaborators since the early 2000s.

“Mike’s an amazing talent on trombone, never mind on tenor and baritone sax,” Davis said by phone from his Connecticut home. “His playing is extremely proficient technically, very soulful and musical. He draws from various periods of the jazz tradition, and he does it with ease. He’s a very expressive player: I just enjoy hearing him.”

Davis wrote the title tune for Grove’s Groove, a 13-bar blues that previously appeared on albums by Davis and Benny Golson. The tune was dedicated to Davis and Dease’s mutual friend Roy Hargrove, in whose bands they both played. “Mike asked me if he could record the song, but at the time I didn’t know he was going to call the whole album Grove’s Groove,” Davis said. “I think it’s wonderful to pay homage to Roy Hargrove — all day long, every day.”

Dease is perennially busy: In addition to prolific work as a leader and sideperson, he’s a professor at Michigan State University; leads the Jazz Institute of Brevard Music Center in North Carolina and the Seiko Summer Jazz Camp in Tokyo; and teaches summer jazz programs at Skidmore Jazz Institute in Saratoga Springs, New York, and the JALC Summer Jazz Academy at Bard College in Annandale-on-Hudson, New York. That’s where DownBeat caught up with him via Zoom.

Allen Morrison: You started out as a saxophonist in your teens, then switched after hearing Curtis Fuller on Coltrane’s Blue Train album. What was it about Fuller’s playing that turned your head around and made you want to switch to trombone?

Michael Dease: Well, to me, he played the trombone like a saxophone. It reminded me of Charlie Parker. It was nimble and quick, deft, intelligent, witty. And it had this wide, airy, subtle, romantic, beautiful sound and tone … . I didn’t know the trombone could function on a level like that.

Those are the qualities that Charlie Parker, Sonny Rollins and Sonny Stitt had that captured me, and the beautiful intelligence that they played with. When I heard the trombone do that, I was just flabbergasted that it was even possible. The sound was so unique — it took me over. I felt possessed by a need to play. And I dreamed of mastering the instrument in a similar way.

Morrison: You play with lots of different ensembles; even from one album to the next, the personnel are often different. Do you have a regular group?

Dease: I think of it more as frequent collaborators than a regular group. For instance, (drummer) Ulysses Owens Jr. and (bassist) Rodney Whitaker are musicians who appear on multiple sessions of mine. When we do gigs, I check with them first because we have such a simpatico understanding of what we’re trying to do together and how to support each other. But there’s a whole cadre of other performers I love to play with … they bring out other parts of my musical personality. I love writing different music for different players. I love seeing how changing an ingredient in the music changes the flavor.

Morrison: Your two new albums are very different: one traditional, one experimental. Is that a fair representation of your musical personality? Or is that oversimplifying it?

Dease: Oh, my God, no. Guilty as charged — that’s like autobiographical; that’s me to a “T.” I crave knowledge, and I love learning deeply, going down the rabbit hole of my passions, like the music I fell in love with: hard bop, the blues, funk, R&B. I’m from Augusta, Georgia, so I grew up with that sort of music imprinted on my DNA — Roberta Flack, Dionne Warwick, James Brown, Sam Cooke, Luther Vandross … . I mean, to this day, my two favorite singers are Nat Cole and Ray Charles.

And then I heard the saxophone and R&B music from the ’40s that my father would listen to. That made me fall in love with saxophone. Then hearing Grover Washington and “Mister Magic.” So, a song like “Grove’s Groove,” that connection to the soul of America and the blues sound being realized through the intelligence, the wit and the charm of jazz music — that’s what swing, hard-bop and the “Blue Note sound” is all about.

But I’m also a contemporary person. I live in the moment. So I’m influenced by everything from the ’80s and beyond. That leads me into experimentation and freedom in the music, into creating sounds, sonic palettes and soundscapes. And trying to laugh and joke, too … . There’s a lot of humor in Found In Space, the Gregg Hill record. In fact, the last 15 minutes with you is the most serious I’ve ever been. [laughs]

Morrison: Tell me about being in the inaugural jazz class at Juilliard in 2001. What was it like for you when you heard you got in?

Dease: It was utter amazement being from the South, coming from a place without a lot of resources, and having taught myself trombone. The news that I was going to Juilliard’s first jazz program, for free on a full scholarship, was just … shock and awe. I was so grateful to my mentor at that time, Wycliffe Gordon, who was teaching there. In Augusta he was a hometown hero; he left to tour with Wynton. I had taken a few lessons with him in Augusta on saxophone. I reached out to him, and he set up an audition for me.

Everyone in the program was an outstanding talent. They all knew way more about jazz than I did. I was playing by ear, and I had only been playing the trombone for about a year. I had just taught myself to read bass clef. I couldn’t read chord changes … . I needed remedial work on sight-reading, chord identification … . I didn’t know any tunes or chords. For not knowing any theory, I had a decent ear. I have perfect pitch, but that didn’t mean I could play changes. I would have loved to have more resources, but I got to New York, and everybody was so far along; it really inspired me to get to work.

Morrison: The album Grove’s Groove is dedicated to, and inspired by, Roy Hargrove. When did you first meet him and how long were you in his band?

Dease: In about 2008, I was in my mid-20s, playing with Jimmy Heath’s big band at the Blue Note in New York, and Roy was in the band that night. I remember I was taking a solo on his arrangement of [Kenny Dorham’s] “Una Mas.” And I must have played something he liked, because Roy started hollering behind me, like, “Damn! Woo!” — that kinda thing. When I left the club, before I could make it to West 4th Street, I heard Roy behind me saying, “Yo! Dease!” And I stopped, and he ran up to me and was like, “Man, you’re in my band. We’re gonna take the big band on the road.” We started playing at the Jazz Gallery and then did a month-long European tour… . I continued playing with him until 2016.

Morrison: How did you pick the songs for Grove’s Groove?

Dease: The title track is something Steve Davis wrote for Roy. It should be a standard — we need to recognize it. I feel the same way about some of Renee Rosnes’ and Christian McBride’s compositions. That’s also why I chose “Minor Funk” by Cyrus Chestnut and “The Viper” by Charles McPherson. They are both great composers, and Cyrus is another musician who had a really deep connection with Roy Hargrove. They’re not as old as Monk, Wayne and Duke and those cats. They’ve contributed artistic masterpieces, but they don’t get covered much because younger generations skip them. So I try not to do that. “Broadway” is an arrangement by Rodney; it was something he played with Roy. He does a whole lot on that with a very simple theme; the melody has call-and-response, it swings on the bridge, and there’s a lot of dialog and conversation.

Morrison: In addition to Rodney on bass and Ulysses on drums, the album has guitarist/singer Jocelyn Gould, trumpeter Terell Stafford and pianist Bill Cunliffe. And, on top of that, you’ve got this great interplay between your baritone sax and Steve Davis’ trombone.

Dease: I love the bari and trombone sound, too. Talk about a joy — getting to call your favorite trombonist to play on your record as a trombone player. Man, I can’t get over that! And he’s been like a role model for me, too, not just as a musician, but as a teacher and a family man. My dream as a kid was to be the next Curtis Fuller … . Then I found out, there already is another Curtis Fuller — his name is Steve Davis. [laughs]

Morrison: Let’s talk about the Found In Space album. Gregg Hill’s music is full of surprises — it’s very modern, sometimes even free, but sometimes it takes an unexpectedly traditional turn into the blues or traditional American music. Does it remind you of anybody else’s music?

Dease: There are hints of other influences from great writers — he is extremely well versed in the whole history of jazz. He can hear a band and tell you exactly who’s playing. He’s interesting. He drove an 18-wheeler and did a lot of different odd jobs before he got into the computer field in the ’70s and ’80s; he’s since retired. Now he supports jazz events in Michigan, and he started a weekly jam session in Lansing.

His music is different and fun to play. The gloves come off with his music, especially when you have musicians like the ones I put together on this record. I wanted a chamber ensemble-type sound with winds.

[The band includes Rudresh Mahanthappa, alto saxophone; Sharel Cassity, flute; Virginia McDonald, clarinet; Nanami Haruta, trombone; Jason Hainsworth, tenor saxophone; Matt White, trumpet; Katie Thiroux, bass; Colleen Clark, drums; Kevin Jones, percussion; and Gwendolyn Dease (Michael’s wife, who teaches percussion at Michigan State), marimba.]

Rudresh also played on my album Best Next Thing (Posi-Tone). He is so distinctive; he was essential to this project. And I’ve never heard the clarinet played like Virginia plays it. She reminds me of a George Coleman-type improviser, but on clarinet. Nanami is from Japan; I think she’s really gonna be the future of the trombone. I play baritone on about half the record.

One thing I thought about was where the musicians are coming from and what generation they’re in. So it’s really nice to have Nanami, who’s in her early 20s, and Bill Cunliffe, who’s in his late 60s. That’s a really neat exchange of experience and information when musicians of different generations play together.

Morrison: I’ve heard you say that racial and gender integration in your bands is also important to you.

Dease: Yeah, that’s super important to me. I like to assemble a band with different perspectives. I grew up in the not-so-recently integrated South. My mother is Black, and when she moved to Augusta, Georgia, in 1977, she couldn’t eat at restaurants. Augusta didn’t fully integrate until ’78. And the history of misogyny in jazz is well known. If there’s anything I can contribute to the notion that bands shouldn’t be all male or exclusive in any way, I’d like to get rid of those lines. Bands play better when people of different backgrounds and experiences play together. DB